tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post4854094161931521016..comments2024-03-22T08:04:05.869-07:00Comments on 魚之樂: 向沈旭暉進一言: 辭達而已矣Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger35125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-8070633021500781392011-05-14T09:58:47.312-07:002011-05-14T09:58:47.312-07:00GP,
Thank you for your comments.GP,<br /><br />Thank you for your comments.W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-46410810444329243002011-05-14T08:28:22.081-07:002011-05-14T08:28:22.081-07:00It's hardly conceivable that Simon Shen, as a ...It's hardly conceivable that Simon Shen, as a international relations scholar by professon, would use philosophical concepts in an article which intended to address to the general public. It seems to me that a more appropriate (and in fact much simpler) translation for 「形而上」(following Shen's logic) would be bottom-up, whereas 「形而下」would be top-down. This should explain why Shen brings up the May Fourth Movement in the article to show that the condescending, top-down intellectual debates motivated grass-root responses which were interactive on many levels. Nothing very theoretical here.「多元」probably just means the diversity of opinion, or multi-lateralism in this case.GPnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-22693866539076528792011-02-01T19:36:56.376-08:002011-02-01T19:36:56.376-08:00文少,
是嗎?會過去一讀大作。文少,<br /><br />是嗎?會過去一讀大作。W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-91359818240808654742011-02-01T15:02:51.773-08:002011-02-01T15:02:51.773-08:00實在忍唔住﹐要寫篇文鬧佢﹐唔鬧佢真係對唔住自己(怒)實在忍唔住﹐要寫篇文鬧佢﹐唔鬧佢真係對唔住自己(怒)文少http://jonathan_sky.mysinablog.com/index.phpnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-38355950130861404822011-02-01T10:04:58.245-08:002011-02-01T10:04:58.245-08:00文少,
那兩句的確大有問題,他文法大亂的句子多的是。文少,<br /><br />那兩句的確大有問題,他文法大亂的句子多的是。W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-1360456709216399292011-02-01T08:52:54.432-08:002011-02-01T08:52:54.432-08:00唔好意思都要講句﹐條友文筆直頭係狗屁不通﹐連小學生都好過佢。
單係“有說你選擇那場合作深度發言,是因...唔好意思都要講句﹐條友文筆直頭係狗屁不通﹐連小學生都好過佢。<br />單係“有說你選擇那場合作深度發言,是因為我們太溫和而籠絡、或太反叛而立威﹕這是non-issue。”已經充滿問題。<br />佢文筆出問題﹐根本就已經遠遠超過語意不清的問題﹐而係連白話文基本文法出錯。<br /><br />“你選擇那場合作深度發言”﹐介詞去左邊﹖而當“深度發言”被視作一個名詞時﹐名詞前面又唔見左動詞。<br />“是因為我們太溫和而籠絡、或太反叛而立威”﹐本身又係狗屁不通﹐用改動最少的簡單改法﹐是“是因為(你覺得)我們太溫和而(去)籠絡、或太反叛而(要)立威”<br />後面“﹕這是non-issue。”﹐先唔講中英夾雜﹐有“無關宏旨”唔用而死用英文啦﹐我亦唔講用錯標點符號呢個問題啦﹐單講“這是non-issue”呢句﹐non-issue作為noun﹐前面唔加量詞唔係問題呀﹖但至少後面要加個“的”...<br />堂堂一個大學副教授﹐既然要弄得偽學術﹐我倒退一萬步﹐容許你寫英式中文﹐但你連寫文連主語﹑謂語﹑賓語﹑連接詞﹑動詞﹑量詞﹑助語詞都寫到亂七八糟﹐我寧願條友直接寫英文﹐然後用google中英語文翻譯機算數啦...文少http://jonathan_sky.mysinablog.com/index.phpnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-51151047823021055592011-01-29T23:41:17.612-08:002011-01-29T23:41:17.612-08:00已看了,謝謝!那篇文章可算拳拳到肉。(其他讀者:該文已貼在「公諸同好」)已看了,謝謝!那篇文章可算拳拳到肉。(其他讀者:該文已貼在「公諸同好」)W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-19235174244701234142011-01-29T23:24:22.040-08:002011-01-29T23:24:22.040-08:00今天明報有一文對沈君作出很到位的批評。今天明報有一文對沈君作出很到位的批評。Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-45258414807689633342011-01-28T06:25:59.433-08:002011-01-28T06:25:59.433-08:00匿名,
//佢之前好似有一篇講五十後既超穩定結構文章
我没有詳細看過
但係我有限既知識內,超穩定結...匿名,<br /><br />//佢之前好似有一篇講五十後既超穩定結構文章<br />我没有詳細看過<br />但係我有限既知識內,超穩定結構指中國封建社會多<br />實在不明白為何可以用落香港呢個短短幾十年既社會內。//<br /><br />- 「超穩定結構」是本人行外的術語,看字面實在猜不到是甚麼意思。W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-89685338273254958662011-01-28T06:23:37.482-08:002011-01-28T06:23:37.482-08:00CYC,
//現在才知道他在別的話題上還另有高論。//
- 沈君非常多產,而且不止於評論時事。CYC,<br /><br />//現在才知道他在別的話題上還另有高論。//<br /><br />- 沈君非常多產,而且不止於評論時事。W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-5580005015974199942011-01-28T04:54:51.635-08:002011-01-28T04:54:51.635-08:00佢之前好似有一篇講五十後既超穩定結構文章
我没有詳細看過
但係我有限既知識內,超穩定結構指中國封建社...佢之前好似有一篇講五十後既超穩定結構文章<br />我没有詳細看過<br />但係我有限既知識內,超穩定結構指中國封建社會多<br />實在不明白為何可以用落香港呢個短短幾十年既社會內。Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-83687280553483297112011-01-28T03:17:17.644-08:002011-01-28T03:17:17.644-08:00我以前讀過沈分析中國民族主義的幾篇文章,覺得他講得不夠透徹,就沒有再追讀他的東西了。現在才知道他在別...我以前讀過沈分析中國民族主義的幾篇文章,覺得他講得不夠透徹,就沒有再追讀他的東西了。現在才知道他在別的話題上還另有高論。CYCnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-26087992525001922732011-01-27T09:46:25.409-08:002011-01-27T09:46:25.409-08:00Roger,
//想來出於崇拜其高尚學歷居多,睇唔明仍照啃者大不乏人//
- 也不止是學歷,他那...Roger,<br /><br />//想來出於崇拜其高尚學歷居多,睇唔明仍照啃者大不乏人//<br /><br />- 也不止是學歷,他那年少有為和衣著髮式出眾的形象可能也有點關係。W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-90226277953066969922011-01-27T09:43:29.180-08:002011-01-27T09:43:29.180-08:00Snowdrops,
I am going to write a short piece on「形...Snowdrops,<br /><br />I am going to write a short piece on「形而上」及「形而下」 and post it here this evening; hope it will be helpful to you.<br /><br />Don't worry, I didn't find your comments offensive in any way.W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-18176429532023240462011-01-27T09:20:30.140-08:002011-01-27T09:20:30.140-08:00Okay just want to say that after quite a bit of di...Okay just want to say that after quite a bit of digging I found out that 真主黨燈塔電視臺 refers to Al Manar (see wiki entry here for anyone who might be interested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Manar). And I only found this out because page 4 of the Google happened to retain the heading of a cached but now non-existent page that uploaded Al Manar videos on a Mainland Chinese website!!Snowdropshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15962700356638572864noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-91496089254881326192011-01-27T08:55:43.228-08:002011-01-27T08:55:43.228-08:00羅渣插口:
以前看沈某論時局世政的文章,確有許多未聽過未想過的新名詞和新概念(例如甚麼是「次主權」)...羅渣插口:<br />以前看沈某論時局世政的文章,確有許多未聽過未想過的新名詞和新概念(例如甚麼是「次主權」),頗有些大開眼界之感,然而看得多了,見其越「撻」越多,多到令人吃不消,恕本人才疏學淺,睇唔明就放棄,以免壞腦(早已壞左,唔想加劇病情)!<br />得出一個老掉大牙的結論,要「深入」唔難,要「淺出」才考工夫!<br />不過沈某仍有不少「fan 屎」,想來出於崇拜其高尚學歷居多,睇唔明仍照啃者大不乏人!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-85255575683067460622011-01-27T08:26:52.191-08:002011-01-27T08:26:52.191-08:00Oh, just saw the above comment as well, I just hop...Oh, just saw the above comment as well, I just hope you didn't feel that I was "attacking" you (or Sinan) in my long-winded comment above, and I'm genuinely interested in your take Prof Wong on the correct translation of the above philosophical terms. Many thanks in advance.Snowdropshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15962700356638572864noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-31555838299620799722011-01-27T08:08:48.027-08:002011-01-27T08:08:48.027-08:00Hi Wong, Sinan:
Sorry for interrupting your conv...Hi Wong, Sinan: <br /><br />Sorry for interrupting your conversation, but I am seriously wondering how does one translate 「形而上」及「形而下」, because from what I can gather online these terms came from I Ching, but from what I was able to understand these two terms are quite similar to Western philosophies relating to Idealism and Empiricism. I am genuinely interested in finding out what might be the correct technical terms to translate these in English, and would be grateful to you (or anyone else) who might be able to help. <br /><br />Just a brief comment on this as well: "不過其文章就有一個特色,就是對其要批評的說法或題材,研究資料精準,往往比本來提出該說法的人更清楚,少有能及。"<br /><br />I have read some of Shen's earlier output, and whilst I agree that he does reference his articles with proper scientific (or social scientific) evidence, what I found alarming is that some of his essays took advantage of the relative lack of knowledge among his audience regarding proper political terms to make his argument sound more legitimate than it is (e.g. in one of his past essays he translated "Fascist corporatism" as merely "corporatism", giving readers the misconception that there is only one type of corporatism -- the Fascist kind, and in the process falsely legitimising that particular Fascist brand of a broad political theory). <br /><br />I also wish that he would have inserted proper English terms when he was referencing Western ideas or organisations, as it is just damn hard to find out what he meant when English readers like myself are trying to "reverse-engineer" his Chinese terms back into English ones so that those of us used to reading English media for international news could understand his references. <br /><br />For example, in this particular essay of his that I attempted to translate, 蓋達 is used for Al Queda (which I was able to guess as much, but it would have been helpful for him to insert "Al Queda" in brackets), and I still have problem determining what is 真主黨燈塔電視臺 in English (or even Arabic). I understand these are probably well-known terms in the Chinese media, but it would have been helpful for those of us who are overseas to better understand the points that he was making and the references that he was using if Shen could insert the proper English terms whenever he references international incidents in support of his arguments.Snowdropshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15962700356638572864noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-54579482050149538252011-01-27T07:52:24.418-08:002011-01-27T07:52:24.418-08:00Meshi,
唔係所有對拆都好睇咖!我依家學精咗,明知會浪費時間嘅還擊我都費事出招啦!Meshi,<br /><br />唔係所有對拆都好睇咖!我依家學精咗,明知會浪費時間嘅還擊我都費事出招啦!W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-64445088439699672842011-01-27T00:10:58.974-08:002011-01-27T00:10:58.974-08:00//Ah Wong, you have shown much patience and restra...//Ah Wong, you have shown much patience and restrain this time in your responses. //<br /><br />咁就唔過癮啦!以為有好戲上演嘛!Meshihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12656065273291410573noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-82622247396340087652011-01-26T23:31:04.791-08:002011-01-26T23:31:04.791-08:00lin,
//For some reason, I kept thinking "Emp...lin,<br /><br />//For some reason, I kept thinking "Emperor's New Clothes" after reading some of the comments... //<br /><br />- The Emperor's new clothes, indeed!<br /><br />//you have shown much patience and restrain this time in your responses.//<br /><br />- I am evolving.W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-29828035263708390572011-01-26T23:28:17.125-08:002011-01-26T23:28:17.125-08:00For some reason, I kept thinking "Emperor'...For some reason, I kept thinking "Emperor's New Clothes" after reading some of the comments... <br /><br />Ah Wong, you have shown much patience and restrain this time in your responses.linnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-75334103731841031562011-01-26T22:16:37.770-08:002011-01-26T22:16:37.770-08:00司南,
多謝你讀了我這篇青年人不應一讀的文章。你的論點恕我不回應了,因為即使回應,在閣下眼中也不過...司南,<br /><br />多謝你讀了我這篇青年人不應一讀的文章。你的論點恕我不回應了,因為即使回應,在閣下眼中也不過是執著用字而已。W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-2670011153897002282011-01-26T22:03:59.600-08:002011-01-26T22:03:59.600-08:001. 「句子平衡」是中學中英文寫作的要求。
2. 「形而上」及「形而下」,是哲學的入門知識。當然,哲...1. 「句子平衡」是中學中英文寫作的要求。<br />2. 「形而上」及「形而下」,是哲學的入門知識。當然,哲學跟中英文不同,中學生並不一定了解,但我相信沈生的文章的主要讀者不是中學生。<br />3. 「多元」「動輒口誅筆伐」的討論:你想多了。<br />4. 「五四運動...」你看來是在「打倒稻草人」。<br />5. 「青年發表不同意見...」是各點中我唯一認同的,但原句稍改為「青年支持發表不同意見...」已成 (而大概大家都認同這個說法)。為兩個字那麼執著,我只好說:你想多了。<br /><br />沈生文辭冗悶,本為人所共知之事,早期文章每每都如學術論文,更是看得人頭昏腦脹。不過其文章就有一個特色,就是對其要批評的說法或題材,研究資料精準,往往比本來提出該說法的人更清楚,少有能及。<br /><br />今閣下評論沈生的文字時,竟然有部分是:我不懂這個字是什麼意思。<br /><br />若青年人不應沈生為模仿對象,似乎對閣下此文更加不應一讀。司南http://point.south.hk/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4010478591191633760.post-52805696392713112362011-01-26T07:53:13.265-08:002011-01-26T07:53:13.265-08:00仲尼,
//沈君初期的文章不是這樣,愈寫愈差~//
- 是嗎?早期的我倒沒看過。仲尼,<br /><br />//沈君初期的文章不是這樣,愈寫愈差~//<br /><br />- 是嗎?早期的我倒沒看過。W. Wonghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07161244576570372004noreply@blogger.com